Dozens dead in US school shooting

[Dr Frook]

when will americans learn and ban private gun ownership?

look at any other western country that has strict gun laws - these things do not happen anywhere near as often.

your thoughts?

[Shadow00]

After some point, it just becomes a stereotype.
My thoughts are, it no longer shocks me. Person walks in, kills 28 something people and suddenly it's a tragedy. You must really have guts to call it a tragedy, after you, the US, allow gun ownership.
It's like crying over a kid after leaving it with a fork and a socket.

[Ithquentbvare]

This happened close to me.

[meiguorach]

Gun ownership isn't the issue, people. Criminals are going to own guns even if it's against the law. That's why they're called criminals. And if they couldn't have guns, they'd figure out another way to kill. Knives... and even human hands can kill just as well. A maniac can be behind the wheel of a car and kill dozens of people, but we aren't about to outlaw vehicles. Why guns? Being shot by a gun is more merciful than being stabbed with a knife, being killed by human hands, and dying in a car crash.

I am in no way condoning what the killer did, or how he did it. I think it's horrible and my heart is breaking for the families. But gun ownership is not the issue. It is the heart of people. I think that instead of saying guns should be prohibited, we should start teaching the value of human life to more people.

[Dr Frook]

criminals are usually more sensible with their gun use. They dont want to go on shooting rampages - tis bad for business. The ones going on these homicidal rampages are people with no criminal history. Guns are handy, so might as well use them to vent some anger. In other countries where is is really hard to own a single gun, let alone automatic military weapons, someone will not be able to vent with a shooting rampage. They may at best get to kill a couple of people with a knife before being arrested.

that is why places like the UK and Australia have much ... much ... MUCH lower rates of these things occurring.

[Sylvia]

Morgan Freeman's brilliant take on the shooting and recent ones:

"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.

It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single victim of Col
umbine? Disturbed

people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.

CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.

You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."

[meiguorach]

criminals are usually more sensible with their gun use. They dont want to go on shooting rampages - tis bad for business. The ones going on these homicidal rampages are people with no criminal history. Guns are handy, so might as well use them to vent some anger. In other countries where is is really hard to own a single gun, let alone automatic military weapons, someone will not be able to vent with a shooting rampage. They may at best get to kill a couple of people with a knife before being arrested.

that is why places like the UK and Australia have much ... much ... MUCH lower rates of these things occurring.

In China, where people are not allowed private gun ownership, things like this happen just as much, even if it's with knives. There was recently, around the same time as the Conn. shooting, an incident in China where a person slashed 22 children in an elementary school with a knife.

I'm just saying... take away private gun ownership, and our country has one more thing in common with Communist China.

[Ithquentbvare]

First thing's first, I want to point out these two things.

when will americans learn and ban private gun ownership?

look at any other western country that has strict gun laws - these things do not happen anywhere near as often.

your thoughts?

Part of our Constitution allows private gun ownership and there is enough of a backing to defend that. Banning guns will NOT happen in the United States. The key is to ban civilians from owning/purchasing military grade weapons and ammunition. A pistol with nine rounds in the clip or a shotgun is perfectly fine for home defense/hunting.

After some point, it just becomes a stereotype.
My thoughts are, it no longer shocks me. Person walks in, kills 28 something people and suddenly it's a tragedy. You must really have guts to call it a tragedy, after you, the US, allow gun ownership.
It's like crying over a kid after leaving it with a fork and a socket.

Just because we currently have the laws to allow such weapons doesn't mean it isn't a tragedy when 20 children are shot. It isn't "guts" it isn't "chutzpa" it IS tragedy. By your logic it isn't a tragedy when someone crashes their car and dies, hell or even falls in the shower and cracks their head. The circumstances might be extreme, but it doesn't stop it from being tragic. Your lack of empathy to the situation and resolve to shrug it off concerns me.

Gun ownership isn't the issue, people. Criminals are going to own guns even if it's against the law. That's why they're called criminals. And if they couldn't have guns, they'd figure out another way to kill. Knives... and even human hands can kill just as well. A maniac can be behind the wheel of a car and kill dozens of people, but we aren't about to outlaw vehicles. Why guns? Being shot by a gun is more merciful than being stabbed with a knife, being killed by human hands, and dying in a car crash.

Gun ownership isn't the issue, gun control is. There is ZERO reason for anyone to own a weapon that spits out 10 shells a second and has a 60+ round clip. There is ZERO reason for anyone to own Hollow point rounds or Glaser rounds.

The U.K has banned private ownerships in guns and has had an increase of murders with a kitana, because people own that. Yes, people will kill if they truly intend on it. However there is a much harsher social disconnect between running someone through in comparison to pulling a trigger. Let alone that it is significantly more difficult to do so.

The issue isn't "do we ban guns or don't we." It is the easy access to weapons* that have no other intend but to kill a LARGE amount of people. Cars and knives have purposes ASIDE from killing. A Ak-47 has no other purpose but to kill a LOT of people, quickly.

EVERYTHING

Yes, yes, and yes.

In China, where people are not allowed private gun ownership, things like this happen just as much, even if it's with knives. There was recently, around the same time as the Conn. shooting, an incident in China where a person slashed 22 children in an elementary school with a knife.

I'm just saying... take away private gun ownership, and our country has one more thing in common with Communist China.

Having something in common with China has NOTHING to do with the subject matter in hand. If I am not mistaken this is called a Straw Man fallacy in logical debate. You are using the demonization of China and trying to say that if we are like them in some way we are closer to something negative. Please stay on topic.

*Before anyone responds with "but the killer stole the weapons from his mother" the point remains that his mother HAD THESE WEAPONS. I am NOT calling it her fault, I am faulting the easy access to such high caliber and powerful guns.

[GarthVader449]

I don't think you can compare the US with China; that is why they always compare it to the rest of the western european contries. And you say no private owner ship won't make a difference, It will. However I feel the US certainly need tougher Gun laws, I feel there to slack and too easy to get a hold of a gun.

Teaching the value of human life will do little to no effect, as most people who commit crimes like those is at the spur of the moment: all rationally thinking is lost. Or it is a guy-to us- is pysicological unstable and has strong beleifs about what he is doing is right.

I'm not sure how the US permit gun ownership but, I think it should be done in the fashion of the U.K and other countries. Also why do you need a gun in the first place... You DON'T need a gun for self defense unless there is a war going on nearly EVERYONE is allowed to have on, therefore hunting should be the only reason.

[meiguorach]

In China, where people are not allowed private gun ownership, things like this happen just as much, even if it's with knives. There was recently, around the same time as the Conn. shooting, an incident in China where a person slashed 22 children in an elementary school with a knife.

I'm just saying... take away private gun ownership, and our country has one more thing in common with Communist China.

Having something in common with China has NOTHING to do with the subject matter in hand. If I am not mistaken this is called a Straw Man fallacy in logical debate. You are using the demonization of China and trying to say that if we are like them in some way we are closer to something negative. Please stay on topic.

*Before anyone responds with "but the killer stole the weapons from his mother" the point remains that his mother HAD THESE WEAPONS. I am NOT calling it her fault, I am faulting the easy access to such high caliber and powerful guns.

Actually, my China comment had everything to do with the topic...